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Community Wishlist Survey 2019/Citations/VisualEditor: Allow references to be named

< Community Wishlist Survey 2019‎ | Citations

 ◄ Back to Citations  The survey has concluded. Here are the results!


  • Problem: One cannot enter a name for a reference in the VisualEditor. When references are used multiple times, VE automatically assigns ":0", ":1", etc. as names.
  • Who would benefit: Everyone using VE, everyone editing content containing references added using VE
  • Proposed solution: Allow editors to assign individual names to references when clicking on a reference in the VE
  • More comments: This is a resubmit of Community Wishlist Survey 2017/Editing/VisualEditor: Allow references to be named from last year which got a lot of votes but sadly not enough to get into the top 10. Since then, nothing more seems to have happened here.
  • Phabricator tickets: task T52568, task T92432
  • Proposer: SoWhy 15:19, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  • I like this. These reference names are confusing to new editors, highly unmemorable, and cause problems including incorrect citations when people copy text between articles. It causes friction between manual editors and Visual-Editor-using editors. My BibTeX software makes auto-names which run "[surname of first author]_[year of publication]_[first word of title which is not the or A or some other very common word]". The second phab ticket suggests something similar. HLHJ (talk) 02:05, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
    • Exactly. In addition to allowing editors to assign ref tags, the VE should suggest a Harvard style ref tag in the form of first authors last name + year of publication (i.e., "Smith_2017") appended by a, b, c, etc. if necessary to disambiguate. Boghog (talk) 07:21, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  • This would be useful, especially as some editors heavily use refname it may allow to achieve some consistency. What is more, this may be used as an e.g. description text when the references are finally moved to Meta. aegis maelstrom δ 09:27, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
  • We need naming references to solve a problem we see facing our student editors (in the large Wikipedia Education program) and others moving material in from their sandboxes. Using VE they have references named ":0", ":1", etc. The target article often has existing references named ":0", ":1", etc. VE handles the conflict by renaming the incoming references. As students and other editors integrate their new pieces, the first batch will be renamed ":02", ":12", etc. VE will does not know that the next batch coming in should match, and will rename those ":03", ":13", etc. This confuses students and is nearly impossible to fix without learning how to use the source editor. StarryGrandma (talk) 01:59, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Allowing editors to specify the name for a named-ref is like asking if you prefer your poison in mint or cinnamon flavor, as the real problem is the use of named-refs. But if (as Boghog suggests) named-refs were done in a style compatible with {Harv} it would be lot easier to clean up when VE-using editors intrude into an article not using named-refs. A better approach would be to not use named-refs. ~ J. Johnson (talk) 00:08, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
    That's a bizarre, incredibly extremist opinion of referencing. --Izno (talk) 00:36, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
A comment full of inflated hyperbole, signifying nothing. ~ J. Johnson (talk) 23:34, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

VotingEdit

  •   Support Ironupiwada (talk) 18:36, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Galobtter (talk) 18:58, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Cohaf (talk) 19:23, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Araratic (talk) 22:43, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Kerry Raymond (talk) 23:11, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Jeroen N (talk) 23:39, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support DonBarredora (talk) 23:49, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Yousou (talk) 00:25, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 03:48, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Afernand74 (talk) 09:19, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Frettie (talk) 09:49, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 10:08, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support FF-11 (talk) 10:28, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Nimrodbr (talk) 10:38, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 10:55, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 11:15, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support I will try to notify all the participants, who voted for this previously. Winged Blades of Godric (talk) 13:03, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 13:30, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Zoranzoki21 (talk) 14:26, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Theklan (talk) 18:09, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support I'd prefer it to be even stronger, with VE automatically giving a meaningful name rather than a number. Naming a ref as ":0" goes against the spirit, if not the letter, of the guideline on en.wiki which says "The text of the name can be almost anything‍—‌apart from being completely numeric", and the help file which says "Names must not be purely numeric; they should have semantic value so that they can be more easily distinguished from each other by human editors." PamD (talk) 18:20, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support ··· 🌸 Rachmat04 · 18:32, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Amir (talk) 19:08, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Vwanweb (talk) 19:18, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support For compliance with EnWP guidelines — pythoncoder (talk | contribs) 19:30, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   SupportThanks for the fish! talkcontribs 20:03, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support JAn Dudík (talk) 20:09, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Yamaha5 (talk) 20:34, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Yep! I mostly use the VisualEditor even though I am well-versed with wiki markup and this feature would be extremely nice to have! SshibumXZ (talk) 21:00, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   SupportAmmarpad (talk) 21:20, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support --Hadibe (talk) 22:20, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support both editor-assigned names and better default names. HLHJ (talk) 22:22, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Tom (LT) (talk) 23:16, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Imzadi 1979  05:14, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Poya-P (talk) 06:17, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Jules78120 (talk) 09:56, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support فرهنگ2016 (talk) 10:40, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Don't use the VE but seems useful for those who do. ~ Amory (utc) 12:28, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Eddie891 (talk) 12:39, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Hanooz (talk) 13:33, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Micromesistius (talk) 14:01, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support stwalkerster (talk) 17:16, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Dvorapa (talk) 17:27, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support — Draceane talkcontrib. 17:57, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Fatemi 18:52, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Ninovolador (talk) 20:09, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support --Wargo (talk) 22:45, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support paul2520 (talk) 00:08, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Waddie96 (talk) 07:45, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Zeromonk (talk) 10:03, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Please! Trizek from FR 10:37, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support β16 - (talk) 10:46, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   SupportTheDJ (talkcontribs) 10:55, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Demostene119 (talk) 11:55, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Veikk0.ma (talk) 12:40, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Anything is better than the current naming, but forcing the user to give a name would be optimal. Wumbolo (talk) 12:45, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   SupportJ.S.talk 15:18, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support ONUnicorn (talk) 16:11, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Sadads (talk) 17:56, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support StringRay (talk) 22:00, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support BugWarp (talk) 01:04, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support I've commented on student's problems with reference name conflict in the discussion section. StarryGrandma (talk) 02:02, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 04:02, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Iridescent (talk) 10:12, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Famousdog (talk) 11:03, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Vulphere 12:45, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Philk84 (talk) 14:01, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Liked. Makes sense. Fredericknoronha (talk) 22:20, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support CAPTAIN RAJU(T) 22:37, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Novak Watchmen (talk) 00:14, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Skyman gozilla (talk) 20:02, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Nihlus 22:20, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Saung Tadashi (talk) 02:51, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support TheAwesomeHwyh (talk) 12:03, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Vexations (talk) 14:54, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Andycyca (talk) 19:32, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support SalmanZ (talk) 21:10, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Siddhant (talk) 01:21, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support MisterSynergy (talk) 10:30, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Sahaquiel9102 (talk) 17:12, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Sannita - not just another it.wiki sysop 00:31, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Shushugah (talk) 05:18, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Matěj Suchánek (talk) 08:52, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Gce (talk) 17:18, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support An obvious BUG that shouldn't have had to come to the community wishiist to be fixed. — Insertcleverphrasehere (or here) 11:42, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Abujoy (talk) 13:51, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support HeinrichStuerzl (talk) 21:11, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support — AfroThundr (u · t · c) 02:02, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support WhatamIdoing (talk) 02:28, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Boghog (talk) 07:21, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Slashme (talk) 08:12, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Dreamy Jazz (talk) 13:29, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Jklamo (talk) 15:08, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Ckoerner (talk) 15:57, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support DMacks (talk) 19:14, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Dick Bos (talk) 20:38, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Sounds good. Mathieugp (talk) 21:37, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support And for WTE17 too? Pretty please? :) --Izno (talk) 00:35, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Zache (talk) 04:10, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 12:33, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Framawiki (talk) 18:35, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Risker (talk) 21:14, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Strong support I hate those ":N" references with the fire of a thousand suns. I didn't realize that they're VE defaults. The sooner they're gone the better. Daniel Case (talk) 02:36, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support — regards, Revi 11:19, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support I don't know if I am allowed to support my own proposal though? Regards SoWhy 14:48, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
    It's redundant, as you can see in this thread. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 16:13, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support Useful feature, will improve readability of the code for source editors — NickK (talk) 16:32, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support XanonymusX (talk) 17:07, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
  •   Support I have no idea why this isn't there already. Cymru.lass (talk) 20:18, 29 November 2018 (UTC)