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Requests for new languages/Wikipedia Hanja 2

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See also the 3rd request (open)

​
submitted verification final decision

This proposal has been rejected.
This decision was taken by the language committee in accordance with the Language proposal policy based on the discussion on this page.

A committee member provided the following comment:

"Hanja" is not a separate language. As the Korean language today is written with mostly Hangul characters and a bit of Hanja, it makes no sense to create a Hanja-only wiki. --MF-W 15:39, 16 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • The community needs to develop an active test project; it must remain active until approval (automated statistics, recent changes). It is generally considered active if the analysis lists at least three active, not-grayed-out editors listed in the sections for the previous few months.
  • The community needs to complete required MediaWiki interface translations in that language (about localization, translatewiki, check completion).
  • The community needs to discuss and complete the settings table below:
What Value Example / Explanation
Proposal
Language code  (SIL, Glottolog) A valid ISO 639-1 or 639-3 language code, like "fr", "de", "nso", ...
Language name Hanja Language name in English
Language name 韓國語(國漢文) Language name in your language. This will appear in the language list on Special:Preferences, in the interwiki sidebar on other wikis, ...
Language Wikidata item Q485619 - item has currently the following values: Item about the language at Wikidata. It would normally include the Wikimedia language code, name of the language, etc. Please complete at Wikidata if needed.
Directionality LTR Is the language written from left to right (LTR) or from right to left (RTL)?
Links Links to previous requests, or references to external websites or documents.
Site URL .wikipedia.org langcode.wikiproject.org

Settings
Project name 위키百科 "Wikipedia" in your language
Project namespace 위키百科 usually the same as the project name
Project talk namespace 위키百科討論 "Wikipedia talk" (the discussion namespace of the project namespace)
Enable uploads yes Default is "no". Preferably, files should be uploaded to Commons.
If you want, you can enable local file uploading, either by any user ("yes") or by administrators only ("admin").
Notes: (1) This setting can be changed afterwards. The setting can only be "yes" or "admin" at approval if the test creates an Exemption Doctrine Policy (EDP) first. (2) Files on Commons can be used on all Wikis. (3) Uploading fair-use images is not allowed on Commons (more info). (4) Localisation to your language may be insufficient on Commons.
Optional settings
Project logo This needs to be an SVG image (instructions for logo creation).
Default project timezone Asia/Seoul "Continent/City", e.g. "Europe/Brussels" or "America/Mexico City" (see list of valid timezones)
Additional namespaces For example, a Wikisource would need "Page", "Page talk", "Index", "Index talk", "Author", "Author talk".
Additional settings Anything else that should be set
submit Phabricator task. It will include everything automatically, except additional namespaces/settings. After creating the task, add a link to the comment.

Proposal edit

I want to reguest for creating a 韓國語 Wikipedia which means Korean Wikipedia. I know actually there is Korean pages in here but the language i want to add is slight difference from normal Korean language. In general, we write Korean itself as 한국어 in Korean. However, there are still many people write Korean as 韓國語.

Historically, Korean language had two writing systems. First one is using only Hangul in Korean which is phonogram. Second one is using Hangul and Chinese character in Korean.
If I compare it to Japanese, which uses original Japanese character(hiragana and katakana) and Chinese character(Kanji). First one would be like ありがとうand second one would be 有難う
In Korean, It would be 감사합니다 and 感謝합니다
I know this is a mere different writing form that easy to be rejected. But, writing Korean using Hangul and chinese character is also traditional way to write Korean. And also, since Chinese character is ideogram that express meaning of the words. It can be very different and distinctive than normal Korean.

Here is some sites written in 韓國語 http://www.hanjanews.com/ http://kore.wikia.com/wiki/%EB%8C%80%EB%AC%B8

Korean is a language which can be written in Chinese characters for clarity. This system, called Hanja Honyong, is used frequently in Korean academia, by lawyers, by historians, and other technical fields. I would not like to create a new Wikipedia for this but rather integrate it into the existing KR Wikipedia framework as is done with Simplified and Traditional Chinese. Because people still use this method of writing, as people do between Simp. and Trad. Chinese, I think having an ability to actively switch between an article written in Hangŭl exclusively and Hanja mixed script would be very useful. Such a thing would also come into use for youth in Korea who would like to practise their ability to read Hanja and learn on Wikipedia. There are tools such as Hanjaro: http://hanjaro.juntong.or.kr/text_translater_eng.aspx?hu=1, which can convert Hangŭl to Hanja with astounding accuracy in most cases and when not accurate these can be corrected by editors. I think this project is worthwhile as well because most academic works in Korea are written this way and it would allow for a greater breadth of works to be used on Wikipedia in general. — The preceding unsigned comment was added by Trotimus (talk) 13:40, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion edit

Please get a Korean Wikisource consensus before filing a task like phab:T182482 or do something there, thanks. — regards, Revi 08:38, 9 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
And please note that Korean Wikisource consensus seem to be "Hanja does not belong to Korean Wikisource, it belongs on Chinese Wikisource". s:ko:위키문헌:사랑방#한문 문헌의 수록 문제. — regards, Revi 08:44, 9 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@-revi: Because of rationale mentioned in the phabricator task, please treat the task as filed in error or equivalent.
Also, the Korean wikisource consensus being linked is about Hanmun, not Hanja. Hanmun is equivalent to Literary Chinese, while Hanja is just a character form that can be used to facilitate the writing of various languages, including Korean.
And at last, despite all of the discussions being conducted above, and despite I have linked this request from the now-closed phabricator ticket, please consider that this is a request for Korean Wikipedia written in Hanja script, not a request for converter between different scripts on any wikiprojects, and thus future discussions about the proposal should probably either go back to the now closed phabricator ticket, or user talk pages of involved users, or in relevant project talk pages in Korean wikiprojects or meta. C933103 (talk) 18:41, 10 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@-revi: "Hanja does not belong to Korean Wikisource, it belongs on Chinese Wikisource"? Then I will ask Chinese Wikisource users to provisionally host Korean hanja source texts if needed.--Jusjih (talk) 05:11, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Well, this is going offtopic to "Wikipedia Hanja" but anyway... well, there was some misunderstanding but anyway pure Hanja texts does not belong in Korean Wikisource. — regards, Revi 05:19, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@-revi: Chinese Wikisource may take pure Hanja texts, but not mixed Korean in hangul and hanja. Is this your opinion?--Jusjih (talk) 03:23, 24 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support As the participant of first request of Hanja Wikipedia, I think the WRONG policy from Language Committee, have to vanish. The LC in 10 years ago, failed to find the way to include Hanja script into Korean Wikipedia - the reason of the rejection(because of it does not exist, and will not exist). and ISO Code policy for Wikipedia have made because of this project. This policy made more different language - jje(Jejueo) and North-Chinese-Russian Korean to unable to make its sum of the knowledge in its language at that time. I think this was very problematic decision. The writings of ko-kore are something different with Korean in nowadays. And this project have 1,617 articles already. Therefore, the policy have to changed, and LC have to apologize it to all wikimedians. - Ellif (talk) 08:41, 11 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • I fear any other Korean wikiproject will eventually die just like kowikiquote, kowikibooks, kowikinews, kowikiversity. — regards, Revi 09:25, 11 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    • I also agree. Hanja WP would not be easy thing, than the passions from 10 years ago. However, I think the writings and methodologies in Gughanmun have to include into the 'sum of the knowledge'. And KOWP could not do for it. I think that it is for our Strategy 2030, also. - Ellif (talk) 07:19, 13 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    Practically there's nobody taking care of the projects outside kowiki, and I fear this "Wikipedia Hanja" will get the same fate. I'm fine with "Wikipedia Hanja" in Incubator as long as there's a proper ISO 639 code assigned, but I do not support the creation of the new project in a dedicated subdomain and a db, because... nobody would take care of the stuff. Bit of related comment on ko:백:사랑방 (일반)/2017년 제33주#위키여행 많이 이용해주세요. — regards, Revi 05:19, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Galadrien: As far as I understand, the usage situation of Hanja among Korean people in Northern Chinese when writing in Korean aren't really that different from Korean people in Korea (as in the mostly lack of usage), although most of them also speak, read and write Chinese which make them able to understand the script easier? As for Jejueo, the previous request was closed for the lack of ISO 639-3 code. Because the code have been requested in 2014 and created in 2015, if you open a new request for Jejueo Wikipedia now, I believe there is a high chance that it would gain eligibility. (Although that does not mean it would be approved for creation, which will depend on level of activity it can attract).C933103 (talk) 15:14, 11 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    • First of all, 'North-Chinese-Russian Korean' means the combination of North Korean(북한어/문화어), Chinese Korean(조선족 한국어), and Russian Korean(고려어). They have similarities with South Korean, but also have visible dissimilarities in written form, also. Therefore, It have to made with another wikipedia.
      For the most of under-40 Korean, Now Hanja is difficult thing, because they do not have a live with it. This is the Korean Wikipedia could not include Gukhanmun form - because most contributors could not do it. - Ellif (talk) 19:08, 12 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
      • Ah sorry for misunderstanding but the same still holds. If I recall correctly, there was suggestions to use language converter or support via other means on Korean Wikipedia to cater for the North-South orthographic difference, but the issue have been deferred to until there are significant amountof internet users from the North? C933103 (talk) 01:41, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
        • No. North koreans also DO NOT USE hanja in their life. And I do not have remembrance for the any consensus with using technical support for hanja or North Korean, inside the KOWP. Rather, some KOWP users suggested to remove hanja marking in the first paragraph. and some users have negative opinion on using hanja in the center of the article. Moreover, As I know, all North Korean contribution in KOWP have reverted, and regarded as the vandal, because KOWP uses the South Korean only. - Ellif (talk) 04:15, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
          • In my latest reply I was specifically talking about North Korean orthography, not hanja. Edit: Note: If I recalled correctly, the decision I was reading was made some years ago (2005-2009?), and thus there could be changes that I am not aware of about.C933103 (talk) 02:07, 15 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
            • @Galadrien: I consider removing hanja marking in the first paragraph too excessive, but based on my experience learning Korean and thus having to adapt to pure hangul, not using hanja in the center of the article is tolerable, but exceptions should still be considered for proper nouns that cannot be readily obtained from dictionaries. Fro example, the lists of cast members in Korean dramas and films may sometimes have hanja names in screen. Dictionaries cannot normally get them. After all, any attempt to retrofit hanja with any converter should be tried on Korean Wikisource first.--Jusjih (talk) 04:17, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - It's difficult that Hangul only Korean articles coexist with articles in the mixed script of Hangul and Hanja in a same wiki because it's almost impossible machine translation between them. Hanja is still being used in Korea. So, an independent wiki for the mixed script is needed separating from the existing Hangul-only Korean Wikipedia. --Wikipean (talk) 09:00, 15 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
    Wikisource is much less evolving than Wikipedia, so how about trying your idea to Korean Wikisource first?--Jusjih (talk) 03:46, 19 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • @StevenJ81: So as many users made their support comments, how do we make a test project In Hanja, should we unlock incubator:Wp/kor? --223.104.7.154 06:25, 19 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
    Yes, please unlock.--Jusjih (talk) 00:22, 20 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

  Comment Please understand that even if one does not use machine transliteration/transcription, it is entirely possible for one project to have pages in multiple scripts. Please see the following in the Judeo-Spanish (Ladino) Wikipedia, which I work on:

The two pages are directly linked to each other, and there are ways to get them connected through Wikidata, too.
Alternatively, the project linked above (wikia:kore) seems to be handling this quite nicely, as well.
In order for you to get a separate project in Hanja, you will need to show that the community of kowiki is hostile to including Hanja pages, and that there is a real community for a Hanja project that is not served by the conventional Korean script. StevenJ81 (talk) 21:30, 22 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@StevenJ81: Well, I'm afraid that this is the East Asian counterpart of Romanian problem, which means that, like Romanian peoples never agree Moldovan Cyrillic because of the historic Romanian Cyrillic (for more reason of this, email George Ho which is the first man that bumped the likely topic, or join Requests for comment/Extreme abuses at the Romanian Wikipedia), modern Korean peoples will also never agree sharing their Hangul-based ko.wiki* wikis with Hanja-based wikis due to ethnic moods, and with consideration of Wikia, Wikimedia has lesser hacker attack possibility than Wikia (although we can't simply say "never" either), thus I would request to start a "special code judging" vote within langcom-l, to decide if "unbreaking" kor is acceptable for them or not, if successed, I will say a big HOORAY because this one is the first ISO 639-3 code that is indeed splitted usage from its ISO 639-1 "ko". --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 12:36, 31 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
By the way, I would like to ask if Korean Wikiquote prefers pure hangul. Incubator:Wq/mul/Capital city and Incubator:Wq/mul/Flag desecration have a few Korean quotes in hangul and hanja. Hopefully there is no need for separate Korean hanja Wikiquote. My tested Multilingual Wikiquote will take hanja quotes.--Jusjih (talk) 03:32, 1 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Yep, this discussion only suggests creating a separated Wikipedia with Hanja contents, and the reason why I propose to start a vote to get potential approval of "ko-hani" or "kor" is per Language committee/Voting policy:

--Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 04:42, 3 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support We should consider altering the local usage of ISO 639-3 kor from the original Korean Wikipedia. --117.15.55.228 08:34, 25 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong support – This is exactly the sort of project Wikimedia should host. Because the Korean Wikipedia is completely opposed to the use of Chinese characters, there is no space for Korean mixed script, a long-running and important mode of expressing the Korean language. Considering the significance of this mode of writing in Korean history, and also, considering the impact of Sino-Korean vocabulary on the Korean language, this project would allow readers to have a more intimate understanding of the words they use, convey meaning in a mode than is important historically for Koreans, and allow for the more adequate understanding of legal and technical concepts, which are dominated by such vocabulary. In this way, it is very similar to the Simple English Wikipedia, but in reverse. Please accept this proposal, and give the Korean mixed script the space it deserves. RGloucester (talk) 00:13, 6 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  •   Comment @User:Liuxinyu970226 has asked me to start a vote at LangCom on this project request. As he has pointed out, such a vote would require a 2/3 majority to pass. My response to him was that there were other items ahead of this in the queue for me to bring to LangCom, and that I cannot do this until a bit later in the (northern hemisphere) summer. Still, there are some things that you will need to do in the meantime if you want me to bring this to LangCom. See my comments just above:
    • "[Y]ou will need to show that the community of kowiki is hostile to including Hanja pages". The commentary above suggests that this is true. However, the only formal discussion at kowiki seems to have happened over ten years ago. I think LangCom will need to see the results of a current RfC at kowiki suggesting that this position has not changed. And I will strongly encourage the idea that not only script converters but also parallel pages (as on Ladino Wikipedia) are potential approaches to the problem, and that both possibilities should be presented in this RfC.
  • "[Y]ou will need to show ... that there is a real community for a Hanja project that is not served by the conventional Korean script." My doubts on this issue stem from the comments of @User:-revi, someone I very much respect, above. Revi has suggested that this project could be created in Incubator, but that he didn't see enough of a community willing to take care of it as an eventual independent project. If there isn't such a community, then LangCom will not want to support this project.
  • Alternatively, the project linked above (wikia:kore) seems to be handling this quite nicely, as well. The one objection I heard to this was that Wikia is somewhat more vulnerable to hackers than Wikimedia. If that is the only problem, we can move the Wikia project to the new Incubator Plus on Miraheze, which should be safer and easier to use. Why wouldn't that be a workable solution?
At the very least, when I take this to LangCom, those questions will need to be answered, either on this page or in what I post on the LangCom discussion group. StevenJ81 (talk) 14:14, 7 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Latest comment on Hanja usage in Korean Wikipedia was in April 2015 and those who commented was unanimously against it. — regards, Revi 18:21, 7 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Might worth noting that even mixing Korean and Hanja in the domain name is controversial. Korean K-12 education system has long phased out mixed scripts and Hnaja education is optional (up to school discretion). Also that South Korean legislation requires usage of Hangul for (government) official business: s:ko:국어기본법#14 — which means less significance of Hanja in Korean's daily life. — regards, Revi 18:06, 7 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Also modern Koreans thinks Hanja is less significant in their lives, according to Gallup Korea few years ago. # Half of respondents believe Hanja is not within Korean as a lang, and the reason hanja should be used it to disambiguate, which is already done on kowiki. I really don't see any community (or potential contributors) here outside few Chinese contributors, so if they want to take care of the stuff, good luck with that. — regards, Revi 20:13, 9 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@-revi: If Hanja is less significant in their lives, then why there are Hanja names of railway and metro stations? Why there are Hanja road signs? And evevn Hanja "deported"(入國不許)? --117.136.54.18 23:59, 20 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
It's not for Korean nationals. It's for the Chinese or the Japanese. [2] Motoko C. K. (talk) 04:33, 16 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Motoko C. K.: So under your opinion, "光化門" is a Japanese name, rather than a Hanja name, right? --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 02:35, 18 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
It can be a Korean, Chinese or Japanese name. The three languages have their own pronunciation for Chinese characters. In this case, most of the Korean don't need Chinese characters to recognize the signs. As I mentioned below, all official documents by the South Korean government are written in just Hangeul, and the constitutional court agreed that Korean people can understand meaning without Chinese characters. See these Korean road signs at c:File:Cheongju IC-Cheongwon District office-City Hall.JPG and c:File:Chirwon JCT 2.jpg. These don't have any Chinese characters. Motoko C. K. (talk) 09:41, 18 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Motoko C. K.: Your comments about vetoing that Hanja name is currently subject to a Structured Discussion (Flow) topic on zhwiki: w:zh:Topic:Vl2um4vmrxu4gr9j. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 02:14, 26 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I cannot understand Chinese. However, the building was created during the Joseon Dynasty which already collapsed. Motoko C. K. (talk) 15:23, 27 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hi, thank you all for providing the discussion ways, but here I also have a "No, thanks" case: I would just say "No, thanks" to either Wikia or Miraheze for Hanja, because there are really living peoples who can write, speak, communicate with, and (don't surprise) teach Hanja in Northeast China and nearly all Korean Peninsula, plus, many railway and metro stations in South Korea also has Hanja on their station name boards, their signal systems and ticket systems (Dalian metro also plans to do so, afaik), which are therefore and thereafter meaning that Hanja is still deeply rooted living in every South Korean peoples. Thus we would really need to consider Hanja as a separate languoid, that not suitable for a non-WMF contribution ecosystem. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 23:15, 7 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • For the first two questions which Steven asked below, I'd love to say, that said, this is really something that was happened in Romanian, that community members always veto any potential convert ways (see link for what this is pointed to) due to the nationalism in this area. So there's an "Amazon Prime"-like good way, to just build a separated Hanja contribution group from the de-facto kowiki contributing members. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 23:26, 7 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@-revi:, @StevenJ81:, @RGloucester:, @Jusjih:, @Wikipean:, @Ellif:, @C933103:, @Donald Trung:, @Explosivo:, @Kaganer:, @Liuxinyu970226:, @Benlisquare:, @Masoris:, @Visviva:, @Stefanostrian:, @Yes0song:, @WonRyong:, @ITurtle:, @LERK:, @Verdy p:, @Galadrien:, @LuciusValens:, @BlueRbt:, @Russ:, @첫밗:, @Theoteryi:, @Mineralsab:, @Motoko C. K.:, @이강철 (WMKR):, @Ryuch:, @메이:, @Dynamicwork:, @Hwarotbul:, @Jytim:, @Jmkim dot com:, @Ykhwong:, @Sangjinhwa: For your information, the Southern Min Wikipedia now has a test mirror site where all the Southern Min articles are imported by and translated by bot and AI learning enabled. This enables users to view the multiple writing systems by simply selecting from the dropdown menu. When the article translation quality has reached an acceptable level, this feature will be installed on Southern Min Wikipedia.
A similar process could also be tested out for Korean Hangul --> Hanja (ie. Korean mixed script, 국한문 혼용) on Korean Wikipedia. Of course, the Korean users will still write in Hangul, however viewers should also have the option to view the articles in Hanja if they wish to.
The only problem is that when it comes to implementing it on Korean Wikipedia, how many votes are necessary in order to approve it? over 50% majority vote? What if over 50% of Korean Wikipedia users oppose it? (similar to the nationalistic Romanian opposition to Moldavian Cyrillic on Romanian wikipedia).
I am unsure of the Korean public opinion on this, so only the Koreans themselves can help answer this question. --Ernesztina (talk) 02:42, 15 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Opinion it is unable to change Hangul itself to hanja because there is so many options for one Hangul words. This is also the reason for the first suggestion was dropped out. - Ellif (talk) 08:10, 15 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • All of the documents published by South Korean government are written in just Hangeul. The Constitutional Court of Korea decided that it dose not violate South Korean Constitution in 2016. [3]. Motoko C. K. (talk) 04:43, 16 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • There are Wikipedias for varieties of Chinese written in transcriptions developed by Christian missionaries, with the Chinese character version of articles being optional. There are Wikipedias for varietes of German where pages can be shown in subdialects when there's one written in them, so also optional. Both have less prevalent literary traditions than Korean with Hanja while being approved projects. I'm advocating for this to be integrated into the exisiting Korean Wikipedia. What we are discussing is the mixed script, a vast amount of content words have direct Chinese counterparts, with grammatical particles remaining in Hangueul. This is similar to the modern Japanese writing standard. For Korean, it's really simple. Although fully automatic conversion is impossible, it would offer contributors the choice to add Hanja to content words as they like, while the overall text doesn't need to be changed and the Hangueul version can stay the default one. One click and the article would show Hanja for words where they are possible. After all, Hanja is part of the Korean school curriculum. Even Newspaper sometimes have to put Hanja in brackets after the Hangueul because there are just too many homophones in Korean. The option would benefit semantic literacy outside a tedious school subject. There is already such a project on the Internet. The Romanian argument is not valid. Romanian was written using different scripts and inconsistent spellings throughout the history until they settled for the Latin script. Cyrillic remains official in the controversial Pridnestrovian Moldavian Republic, not in the Republic of Moldova. Moreover, it differs from the historical Cyrillic Romanian. The deep-rooted role of Chinese words in modern Korean is not just a matter of script. Thus, no to the request of a entirely new Wikipedia, but yes to implementing Hanja. --91.142.213.109 21:48, 26 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • I want to say that The writing methodology of Sunhangwl and Gughanmun is very different. So, unlike the Chinese, the translation system is in need, rather than of a substitution system. So, could our Foundation make this? I want to remind you of the fact, that LC could not make the solution and do not make anything 10+ years ago already. - Ellif (talk) 13:28, 4 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • I also think that the transliteration of Korean Wikipedia is in need of the Korean between the Republic of Korea - DPRK - Soviet Union, but not hanmun. - Ellif (talk) 05:34, 15 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Noted on the above proposal was incorporated my proposal, in it you can see I've linked this website: http://hanjaro.juntong.or.kr/text_translater_eng.aspx?hu=1, which uses AI to more accurately convert Hangŭl to Hanja and it does a pretty stellar job of it most of the time. You can check it out on the main page here: http://hanjaro.juntong.or.kr/page_translater_eng.aspx?hh=1&hu=1 where you can click on different news websites and it will convert it to 한자(漢字), 漢字(한자), or pure 漢字. It also allows for you to choose which kind of character forms you would like such as PRC Simplified, Shinjitai, Taiwan Standard Traditional, Korean Standard Hanja, etc. I think something like this could be very useful for assisting this project. If you made a bot to run text through the "Text-to-Text" mode and then remove the brackets and corresponding Hangŭl it would work perfectly. Of course there may be some errors but this could be fixed by users later. As of writing this KR Wikipedia has 533,869 articles so I don't think to start a bot converting text and uploading alternate Mixed Script articles is an insurmountable task. - Trotimus (talk) 23:38, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Something similar to how the Min Nan test Wiki handles orthography would be perfect for this project https://taigi.lohankhapedia.org/w/index.php?title=Thâu-ia̍h&variant=nan-hant this would allow users to select for example if they would like to see the article in pure Hangŭl, 한자(漢字), 漢字(한자), or pure 漢字. - Trotimus (talk) 01:08, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • First, Hanjaro is not open source, And it has a large mistake. Second, The consensus of Korean Wikipedia community is to not include hanja in code at all: If the bot works, many Korean Wikimedians will stop contributing for our project. Therefore, It is not acceptable. - Ellif (talk) 02:45, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • What's the large mistake? Also what's the status of the project then? Are Korean Wikimedians on board with it, as that's how it sounds given the use of contributing. - Trotimus (talk) 05:18, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • As well, would it be possible to make something like this of our own? I.e. an AI program which can be fed texts of Hangŭl and Hanja to allow it to learn contextual transliteration. I assume something like that is possible because Hanjaro exists but would there a be a way to improve it to make less errors? I think the notion to not have a bot is kind of silly. It would make a much better argument for the introduction of such a feature into Korean Wikipedia. Asking a bunch of Wikimedians to go manually edit 500,000 pages would be a good way to kill a project at an instant. A bot like that doesn't have to do all of the work but to have it functioning would certainly be inspiring. - Trotimus (talk) 05:26, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hanja does not have a valid ISO 639 1-3 code required under Wikimedia Policy. Langcom should close this request as it does not meet the basic requirement. — regards, Revi 05:40, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Then I guess it should be registered into that system via a proposal. Though I would still leave this open nonetheless as it has provided good solutions to this problem. - Trotimus 06:50, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Also, do Simplified and Traditional characters have their own ISO 639 1-3 code(s)? It doesn't seem like it, so why do they get their own active switching device on ZH Wikipedia? - Trotimus 07:00, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • It is not Wikimedia's interest to get it included in ISO standard. If you are interested in that, you will have to do it yourself.
      • If you want to host Chinese characters in Korean Wikipedia, you will need Korean Wikipedia's approval for that, not here (which is a request for a new language wiki). Chinese Wikipedia has the converter because Chinese Wikipedia community decided they need it. Please note that Korean Wikipedia has consistently rejected that idea, and you have practically no chance of success. — regards, Revi 07:07, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • I'm interested in their reasoning for rejection, I can't think of one other than the normal person reads only Hangŭl. Trotimus (talk) 08:41, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Read the policy I linked. There is no surprise here. — regards, Revi 12:10, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
But for your information:

The Wikimedia Foundation does not seek to develop new linguistic entities; there must be an extensive body of works in that language. The information that distinguishes this language from another must ordinarily be sufficient to convince standards organizations to create an ISO 639 code.

— regards, Revi 12:11, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Oh no, apologies I meant Korean Wikipedia's continual rejection for mixed script optional integration into the website. Is it the same reason? Not having an ISO 639 1-3 code? Or is it some other unrelated reason? Zgw3kszo (talk) 14:33, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Because ordinary people do not mix Hanja and Hangul. In 2021, that's exclusively reserved for Hanja mania, not general public. — regards, Revi 15:39, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Ah so I was right initially, it's just a case of it's useless now for ordinary people. What a shame. Zgw3kszo (talk) 15:54, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • As a side note, doesn't it already fall into ISO standard the same as zh-Hans or zh-Hant might via the kr-Kore ISO 15924 tag? - Trotimus 07:15, 17 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      @Trotimus: Following the currently LPP, using ISO code isn't strict required, but preferred, as it said "Under very unusual circumstances, and provided there has first been an effort to obtain an ISO 639–3 code, the Language Committee may be willing to consider projects in languages having a valid BCP 47 language tag. Languages having neither an ISO 639 code nor a BCP 47 tag will not be considered under any circumstances." (@-revi: should be noted this), however this clause is still being affected by Voting policy, to which using these BCP 47 tags require 2/3 majority of langcom members. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 23:47, 18 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • @-revi: I said that it is the problem Of Wrong policy of LC, not gughanmun itself, already. - Ellif (talk) 12:25, 21 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
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