Wikimedia CEE Meeting 2012/Documentation

This is the documentation of the Wikimedia CEE Meeting 2012 held in Belgrade from 13-14 October 2012.

Saturday (13 October) edit

Opening & Introduction edit

Raul Veede (left) and Miloš Rančić (right) during the introduction
Vladimir Medeyko (second from right to left) introducing himself

This particular Etherpad documents the Introduction of Participants session:

  • Apparently, Milos Rancic (WMRS) and Raul Veede (WMEE) are twins separated at birth! :)
  • Milos explained a game (please explain for those of us who didn't understand...)
  • Introductions
    • the Slovenians: "no chapter, small community; big heart!"
    • the Czechs: "We're all called Jan!"
    • the Turks: "no chapter, unfortunately; I've been editing for five years"`
    • the Macedonians: "Brest: I'm a Wikimedian and Wikipedian; [Toni Ristovski] I'm just from the community"
    • the Greeks: "I'm Eugenia from Greece; we don't have a chapter"
    • the Hungarians: "I'm from the Wikipedia community; we're quite small with a lot of articles; Kalman: I'm a founding member of WMHU; we have about 250 active Wikipedians"
    • the Croatians: "we're not here yet" (Goran pulled off a great impression of Croatian Wikipedians! :))
    • the Poles: "Marek: I'm the treasurer; we're quite big, more than 100 members. Adam (CLI), Daniel (Leinad), Marcin (Saper)."
    • The Belarusians: "We're Pavel and Mark. No chapter yet. We're in final stages of discussion. We hope in the few next months we'll start the registration process. We work in three Wikipedias: in two(!) Belarusian dialects, and in Russian. We recently finished the Wiki Loves Monuments project (with a round budget of zero Euros!), and we have an education program."
    • The Ukrainians: "I'm Ievgen, this is Victor. We have nearly 1500 active editors. About 40 members in WMUA"
    • The Armenian: "I'm Susanna. I'm working on creating a chapter in Armenia. We have about 20 members."
    • The Estonians: "Raul: We have about 30 members in our chapter. We are active since 2010."
    • The Bosnian (Anton Oprešnik): "I live in Austria, I'm a bureaucrat in the Bosnian Wikipedia. My father is Slovenian, my mother is Croatian, my wife is Bosnian."
    • The Russians: "Vladimir: we were founded in 2008. We fight to make the world a better place for free knowledge."
    • The Germans: "Nikolas and Nicole are from Wikimedia Germany."
    • The Foundation: Asaf & Ting. Asaf has money for grants!
  • The Serbs: "We're WMRS. We've done everything for this event! :) Welcome!"
  • The English: "Fae (Ashley), a trustee of WMUK, also here to talk about the Wikimedia Chapters Association. Andy Mabbett (User: Pigsonthewing) is a volunteer from the ENWP community, but is formally representing Wikimedians with beards ("

Organizational management edit

This particular Etherpad documents the Organizational Management session:

The main purpose of this session is to give the smaller communities an insight of the work within the Wikimedia Chapters and the activities that they have. It's a good opportunity as well for the young chapters and the other organized groups to find out ways how to progress with their activities. The most important questions that should be answered during the discussion include:

  • How to run an NGO?
  • How many people are necessary to work in an NGO?
  • What are the advantages and disadvantages of running a Wikimedia Chapters?
  • What changes should be made to promote development of a chapter?
  • To what extend an informally organized group of people can succeed by doing work for an NGO?
  • Aktron (WMCZ)
  • Jernej (Slovenia)
  • Brest (WMMK)
  • Toni Ristovski (WMMK)
  • Marek Stelmasik "masti" (WMPL)
  • Anton (Bosnia)
  • Eugenia (Greece)
  • Pavel Selitskas (Belarus)
  • Mark Bernshtein (Belarus)
  • Kalman Hajdu (WMHU)
  • Fae (WMUK)
  • Ting (WMF)
  • Asaf (WMF)
Discussion notes

Factors to consider in establishing a chapter

  • legal constraints - e.g. necessary board size
  • federal/republic registration, or other geographic definition
  • local reputational issues, such as how often NGOs are used for doubtful reasons in a particular country

(Pavel Selitskas, Belarus) We already have ideas and large projects and are at the final stages before 'incorporation'. The Belarusians obviously had complications to form a city-wide organization, but a state-level seems to be easy to found.

(Jernej Polajnar, Slovenia) Our key problem is finding people willing to do the organizational work and NGO administration, financial reports, taxes from a relatively small pool of volunteers. We should probably do outreach to connect with similar NGOs (on the topic of free culture) but have yet to get there, but have some experience in the background of volunteers.

(Masti (Marek Stelmasik) Poland) on advantages and disadvantages. Experience of running the chapter since 2005. Why be a chapter?

  • represent the community to the Foundation
  • get money - easier to do as a recognized organization
  • tax advantages

In money, WM Poland is larger than the local Red Cross. To approach Government organizations it helps a lot if you are an officially recognized body. Having support from the ministry (in the form of a letter or recommendation) has been a significant advantage in collaborating with institutions, such as museums and galleries.

There is a disadvantage that you need people and professional support to make this work, such as the duties of reporting. There is a risk of fines (and reputational damage) if these duties are not met. A general assembly is required once a year. Getting enough people physically together is a major problem.

Milosh says that this depends on the country's topology and level of centralization. In some decentralized countries it is hard to manage to get all interested people on one place. However, in centralized places most of the community lives in one city (e. g. Belgrade) thus it is quite easy to organize a GA.

Millosh also says that in Croatia the problem is similar, in Slovenia as well. Jernej Polajnar agrees, that a community from Maribor can be hardly on meetings in Ljubljana, 200 kms away.

Masti points out that WMPL (and other chapters) regularly reimburse members who live away from the center (or the venue city) for travel expenses to general assemblies.

Masti also added, that all the polish board meetings are open to general public and they are online on IRC. So even wiki editors but non members can come, but cannot vote. The non-members often go to board meetings. WMPL board meets once a week (!) Masti says the openness of the meetings and the scrupulous note-taking are really helping gain credibility and trust from the general community.

They also keep records of this meetings - printed, and they have to be signed by the board members. This is required by the polish law.

Asaf is asked to explain how to motivate an informal group to do a formal work. Asaf says that the very essence of the existence of a chapter is to do formal work and get money. This has to be adressed to the people who lead the chapter. The wrong message: Chapters are awsome.

Some groups are better off than the others. Some they have personal conflicts, some do easily projects. Some of them are still struggling to do some work. Asaf says that this changed in the past two years. WMF decided to give grants to the people who have a good plan, yet have no chapter. They get the permission to use the trademark, by an e-mail.

Asaf says, that it is best way to start informally and then continue; however, sometimes being informal is a factor that blocks you from doing some kind of a work. Informal group can be really powerful and they can be initiated really easily.

It is a question: Do you need a chapter? When you need a chapter, then found it, because of the paperwork.

Jernej says, that Slovenians negotiate data for WLM without any chapter help. Asaf agrees: geeting a list is an achievement already.

Eugenia asks how chapters manage legal threats. Masti and Fae answered.

The discussion continues with the views how Wikimedia works under anglo-saxon or continental law.

Asaf recommends answering all legal threats politely by explaining you have no control over the contents, and that the servers are owned and operated by the Wikimedia Foundation in the United States, and include the contact information for the Wikimedia Foundation. The WMF legal dept. can handle it from there. :)

Mutual cooperation edit

Nicole Ebber (left) and Kiril Simeonovski (right) during the session about Mutual cooperation

This particular Etherpad documents the Mutual Cooperation session:

Who is who?
  • Nicole Ebber (WMDE) - speaker
  • Kiril Simeonovski - facilitator
  • Marcin Ceslak (Saper, WMPL)
  • Jagro (WMCZ)
  • Leinad (WMPL)
  • CLI (WMPL)
  • Vladimir Medeyko (WMRU)
  • Matjaž Zaplotnik - Slovenia
  • Jan Lochman (Wiki Support, Czech Republic)
  • Andy Mabbett (WMUK)
  • GoranO (WMSR)
  • main spirit of Wikimedian projects is mutual cooperation
  • one example: Wiki Loves Monuments
  • point for discussion: what is cooperation, possible models

"International Affairs Unit" liaison for the coop between WM Germany, WMF, Chapters, Communities...

  • monitor what is going on in int. movement and keep German speaking community up to date with it
  • exchange of ideas and expertise
  • examples of possible benefits/immediate usage scenarios
  • should be launched in January 2013
  • another example: bring all European Chapters together in Brussels
Questions and disscusion
  • GoranO,WM Serbia: asks for clarification about name ("International") and goals --> A: will work with both chapters and international community
  • prepared questions by Nicole:
    • translation of articles
    • ?? from Ukrainian Wikipedia: regional exchange of articles on local topics
    • Marcin: Polish/English/Russian topic exchange, treatment of mutual history on various Wikipedias,
    • ?? : using Simple English Wikipedia as a source for translation
    • Nikola Smolenski, WM Serbia: sponsored articles, where do they eventually come from
    • Raul: History: sources of confusion - different names, different histories; possible resolutions: a collection/translations of sources
    • GoranO: history is sometimes controversial, not so easy to collaborate because of it, cooperation works organically when there is no controversy, we should avoid dealing with things that are controversial and can go wrong

Nicole asks: where do you get your information?

  • Wikipedia:Woche ( )
    • do you have something similar and would it work on international level?
    • GoranO: no, and probably no capacity for it atm, but it could be useful on Meta
    • Marcin: too many information channels already, would probably just add to the confusion, would be better if it replaces something
    • Juandev: distribute existing projects of some regional communities to other communities within CEE region
    • Andy: Int. cooperation already exists on en:W - learn from it how to cooperate on controversial subjects, as well as a model for discussion on those topics

Nicole: Joint projects

  • do you use Meta or Outreach wiki for information exchange? If not, what else?
  • GoranO: mailing lists
  • Marcin: IRC, mailing lists, doubts about meta
  • Nikola Smolenski: thinks most of communication happens at meetings like this one
    • could be put on Meta etc, but these is still a need to inform people there is some information somewhere

Expostcomment: *Juandev: I would just post add, that there were some really interested meetings organised by Moushira. Some of the poeple didnt understand why, but overall feeling was nice.

Nicole: Participation support ( )

  • WM Germany and WMF offer support for travel for conferences outside Wikimedian movements to promote Wikimedia etc
  • GoranO: asks for experiences and results; Nicole: process hasn't yet been reviewed, so no solid number yet
  • Andy: who is eligible for this program -- absolutely every active contributor to the Wikimedia projects!
  • Kiril: is this kind of project Chapters should be running themselves or it should be on run on WMF level? -- Chapters are welcome to contribute money to the global program, and to have representatives in the Participation Support Council.
    • Doing this on the level of multiple individual chapters could work, but has some complications -- what if a person from country A wants to attend an event in country B? Which chapter (A or B) handles the request? What if only one of them has a chapter?
  • Marcin: small traveling grants in Poland, does not think it can be centralized
  • Nicole: idea was that there are not many countries with Chapters or with Chapters that have little funding

Expostcomment: And what about some grants to support Wikimedians travelling on other Wikimedians projects to become their participants. Should it be done just by the organiser, who ask in grant also for schollarship for such people. It cant work vice versa?

CEE and Wikimedia Chapters Association edit

Fæ as a main speaker in the session CEE and Wikimedia Chapters Association

This particular Etherpad documents the Central and Eastern Europeans (CEE) and Wikimedia Chapters Association (WCA) session:

Duration (min): 75 Type of session: interactive presentation with discussion Facilitator: Tanja Mladenović, Julija Vojinović Speaker: Fae (Ashley Van Haeften) Whiteboard/notes: One of the main topics that deserves attention is surely the Wikimedia Chapters Association <>. The region of Central and Eastern Europe is rich with chapters that will participate by having an important role in the newly established association. It's still not clear what will be the single role of any of the chapters from the region, but discussions about the possible impact that these chapters may collectively have is a critical point. Important questions that need to be answered in this session include:

  • What can a chapter from the CEE region do for the WCA?
  • Should we expect the WCA to do something for the development of the CEE region?
  • What are the things that the CEE chapters need help from the WCA for?
  • How to define the role of the CEE partnership in relation with the WCA?
  • Should the CEE chapters be afraid of the Wikimedia Foundation in the future?

  • Fae: presents how money distribution within Wikimedia do, that actually it is done by WMF. Fae highlights that the Foundation is involved in all stages of fund
  • 60% of funding for WMDE comes not from WMF but from their own fundraiser
  • What is a Chapter? Should "non-Chapters" have their say?
  • What is Governance? For us: having transparent funding and...
  • German procedures are not an easy answer to how a Chapter should work

Fae presents Chapters association as an umbrella shielding the chapters. Also, value in shielding us from national identities. WM UK is a federation (Ireland, Scotland ... involved), a movement above national interests. Fae: The WMF doesn't want to be our police force; currently it is. WCA does not want to have authority on everything.

  • Thematic associations can be controversial (e.g. LGBT outreach association)
  • Are there people regreting starting one or wanting to start a Chapter, but are hesitant to do so?
  • Role of WCA in development of new Chapters?
    • Who should fund working of WCA; atm Chapters are funding it
    • What does WMF want from WCA? - WMF does not have any goals for it, Asaf "I am observing with cautious hope" Asaf: "WMF is looking forward to peer-review between Chapters and to Chapter development - WMF was doing Chapter development (pretty much unsystematically) because nobody else did but it is not something WMF should do by default. It's WCA's task."
    • Example of well intended but not mission-aligned work: indigenous language Wikipedias (Wikimedia Chile wanted to spend money and time promoting Rapa Nui language Wikipedia in Easter Island). WMF is happy to store Rapa Nui wikipedia in incubator but doesn't promote this wiki because it is not in the scope of providing free knowledge, due to the tiny number of Rapa Nui speakers (about 3000) -- -- it's not a viable encyclopedia, and never will be.

Funds edit

Marek Stelmasik (right) participating in the discussion in the session about Funds

This particular Etherpad documents the Funds session:

Introductory notes

  • Brest (WMMK)
  • Toni Ristovski (WMMK)
  • Fae (WMUK)
  • Asaf (WMF)
Useful links
Minutes of discussion
  • why do we need funding at all? reimbursement for ad hoc expenses (e.g. travel), recurring expenses (rent, taxes, etc)
  • funding sources (membership dues, direct donations, in-kind donations, grants)
    • grants from Chapters, non-WM foundations, local foundations on various bases (restricted geographically, ideologically, thematically...)
    • when applying for grant, adjust your approach to the entity you are asking funding from (highlight common ground)
  • Fund Dissemination Committeet, for eligible entities --> unlike regular grants, when approving, FDC gives unrestricted funding, can also pay employees
  • Fees for services rendered to others (speaking fees - not for the individual, but for organization)
  • Donations are still the primary source of funding
    • Spending is transparent (discuss money in public, who and how much (s)he gets, applications are public, approval and discussion are public, report is public)
  • Funds belonging to a group should never be controlled by one person (learned that the hard way - two cases of misuse when only one person had access)
  • important to have a process for controlling the money (who decides and how, how is it reported to community)
  • learning from Chapters about how are grants handled
  • ^^^^ introduction on handling money in movements

Questions and discussion
  • Susanna Mkrtchyan (Armenia) - since paypal in Armenia is not fully working, can WMF help with finding a way to fund Armenian Wiki from outside?
  • Criteria for FDC
  • Microgrants programs (WMF does not have one, WMD has Participation Support program - funds travel and accommodation for WIkimedian going to non-Wikimedian events)
  • Andy: how was misuse of funds discovered (mentioned earlier) - discovered by other members in both cases; WMF has no real way to check for this, members have a lot more opportunities to look into this; WMF helped chapters deal with unpleasant situation by giving advice on how to deal with the situation
  • Marcin: problems with funds transfer in Poland/Russia; how to other people deal with it, what are their experiences on this issue (Asaf: no legal way money can be sent to Wikimedian in Russia without getting them in trouble with local government)
  • Asaf: from "zero money" to "some money" - small, but significant step (problem of introducing money into what is/was volunteer group) - best to agree beforehand how is money going to be handled

Chapters professionalization edit

Marek Stelmasik speaking about the Chapters professionalization

This particular Etherpad documents the Chapter Professionalization session:

Some of the Wikimedia Chapters have already started their professionalization by employing paid-staff to manage with their annual program. This is usually supported with the statement that hiring staff with much experience will fuel the development of the chapter and increase the number of projects and activities done in the year, while others argue it as being too expensive to make any greater benefit and something that challenges the freedom of Wikimedia. The discussion should give answers to the following questions:

  • What should a chapter achieve before hiring paid-staff?
  • What position should be considered for the first employee?
  • What are the things that an NGO is not able to do without hiring employees?
  • How to keep the volunteerism in an organization with paid-staff?
  • Does the paid-staff in the Wikimedia Chapters really matters the freedom of Wikimedia?

Who is who?
  • Masti (WMPL) - speaker
  • Fae (WMUK)
  • Jbuket (WMUA)
  • Chen (WMF)
  • Jagro (WMCZ)
  • Juandev (Wiki Support)
  • ? (WMHU)
  • ? Turkish community member
  • Millosh (WMSR)
  • Replicant of Millosh from north:-) (Estonia)
  • Visem (WMUA)
  • Masti: a lot of discussion in WMPL wether to pay volunteers/employees. Finnaly they got two types of employees.
    • a) secretary (half time job, answer phone) b) bookkeeper - necessary required administration such as reports for the Ministry of Finance.

Supporting WLM had to be a paid manager due to the difficulty of finding sufficient volunteer time to ensure this could be delivered.

  • Masti: if there is not a volunteer for necesary activity: probably we should pay him (like Chapter). Do you have payed personel?
  • Hungrian guy: one payed half time person. He was one of the founder of WMHU (administrative work, accounting?)
  • jBuket: one guy from organisation well be awarded for his work in WLM
  • Masti: What are the things that an NGO is not able to do withou hiring employees?
    • Fae: WMUK is not a part of WLM, because they havent foud a volunteer for project managment, thus the chapter havent open WLM even there were 6 people prepared to be part of a steering committee...
    • Masti: need of good accountant push you to pay such person
    • HU: in Hungary the law says that bookkeeper can be an employee
    • Juandev: it depends on the actual needs of the group, e.g accounting in wmcz is cover by kind of barter.
    • Juandev to Fae: why WMUK, havent haired project manager.
      • Fae: too late and quite sized discussion about it wheather it is OK
    • Masti: volunteers refuced to get money for the work they are doing
      • Fae: WMUK payed a volunteer, who asked the chapter to be payed for that, but it was very difficult thing to get right
    • Visem (WMUA): on WLM their hired a person as it was a lot of work
  • Fae: beeing professionals in the organisation. But there are limits in that. The board needs to have a lot of discipline.
  • Juandev: two central European chapters were part of OGDN (Organisational Growth and Developent Network) run by Sebastian from (WMDE). But Czech had change the board at that time and had other problems.
    • HU guy: the board used part of the knowledge delivered by Sebastian. (talking in German, Masti translate:-). HU board it very young.
    • Masti: if we have students in the board, they dont know how the board is working, but WMPL has some lawyers in WMPL.
      • WMPL has a big 7 people board to cover all the need. WMPL can reply answers of people, who are doing something - how it was within WMPL.
      • Fae: do not trust them finnallly, do it by your own.
    • Jbuket: they asked community, who would like to do something with the book and there was a guy, who said "I am professional designer" and thus they can print book professionaly
  • Masti: How many of you had offer from companies to write articles for money?
    • Fae: it happened. There is one payed Wikipedian in residence - also a difficult topic
  • Visem: in Ukraine there is no law to CC license. So if they print a book, according Ukraninien laws it should have still copyrights.
  • Fae: their board underwent some workshops and there were a lot of discussion on the electing chair/manager. It depends how you measure chapter growth (money, people, no. of projects).

Volunteer Management edit

This particular Etherpad documents the Volunteer Management session:

Who is who? / Participants
  • Asaf Bartov (WMF) - speaker
  • Marcin (user:saper, WMPL, organiser of Wikimania)
  • Andy Mabbett (WMUK)
  • Greek Lady
Introductory notes

Minutes of discussion
  • Where do volunteers come from?
    • From projects
      • How do they become volunteers?g
    • From partners
      • GLAM,
      • Marcin - Wikimania Gdansk:
        • partnership with the city (city had a lot of volunteers), they were much more reliable then usual Wikimedia volunteers; people who do stuff online are different then those that prefer to do stuff offline and interested in doing different things
  • Asaf: How to engage volunteers
    • match tasks to skill and preference
      • it is hard to do
      • if it is too hard, maybe you should change your tasks, or you should recruit more
      • most people can be trained to be effective speakers
      • Asaf: "Send your Wikimedians to be trained as speakers" and ask Asaf for money if necessary
      • build portfolio of what your Chapter does
    • have frequent low-barrier, low-key activities (at least monthly)
      • = teaching to edit is high barrier; low barrier activities (they help to get people in):
        • photo hunt - opportunity to chat about various useful thing, does not require a lot of technical knowledge
        • proofreading on wikisource - relatively easy thing to teach people
        • tutored maintenance tasks: e. g. "dead links"
          • Weblinkchecker bot can help in that task looking for dead web links and trying to find copies in internet archive. The links and copies are posted to article discussion page. Voluneteers can easily verify them and copy-paste to article from

talk page. If you want it set up for your wiki ask User:masti

        • e.g. conference is not a low key activity
  • Threats to effective volunteer management
    • burnout - when you lose the motivation to do something
      • prevention:
        • distribute activities
    • strong disagreements:
      • when there are two people and each of them want to do something else and they are not able to compromise
    • personal conflicts
    • power dynamics
      • when one person overtakes all power or doesn't want to allow people to do something
    • bad precedents
      • it makes problems in the future, like making wrong partnership (=reputation problem to the Wikimedia group)
    • vicious cycles
      • negative feedback loops - e.g. project which didnt succeed make future problems
Questions and discussion
  • Andy: make volunteers feel welcome and privileged; give them a 'backstage pass' tour of the store-room or archives, feed them with cake! Asaf: show people they are important
  • Evgenia (Greece): how to let people know they are not up to a task they keep volunteering for
    • Asaf: WMUK gave training for speakers. They were no graded, but they received a feedback from the professional. So the feedback from the outsider/professional is taken better than from non certified professional.
    • Asaf: don't lie to people, do not manipulate people, be opened and take care of the personality of a person
    • Asaf: give personal feedback about experience
  • Ivo (WM Estonia): Does any one has a good examples of low barrier, low key activities?
    • (Kalman Hajdu) (WM HU): speakers of Hungarian accademy of science - people were happy from personal contacts with these academics
    • Matjaž Zaplotnik (Slovenia): adding links to geopedia, unifying/correcting information and links on certain topic (person, art work) across several projects (WP, WS, Commons, Geopedia, Wikiversity)
    • Brest (WM Macedonia): page on Facebook, where people can evaluate articles how they like them or dislike them. They link from Facebook to Wikipedia, which takes these people to the project)
    • Asaf: outreach to groups which are already very motivated (= groups who do something: bird watching group). Make a workshop with them how to improve articles about their field at Wikipedia. Example of librarians in Israel (cru

..who loves to study, get new knowledge. Gave them weekly info how to create a new acount, how to edit wikipedia, etc.

    • Nikole Ebber (WMDE): which group to touch via WLM: photographs, bicycle club (they did bycicle tours around different monument)

Social media communication and public relations edit

This particular Etherpad documents the Social media communication and public relations session:

This session should discuss the role of Wikimedia in the social media and how to use them in order to promote the activities inside the movement. Most of the questions regarding the social media communication and the way that the public relations are arranged are still open and need further clarification and definition. There are some positive examples across the movement that can be used as a good starting point for the following activities. The time slot is also reserved for a presentation with examples about the topic.

Sunday (14 October) edit

GLAM in CEE region edit

Duration (min): 75 Type of session: presentations with discussion Facilitator: Julija Vojinović Presenters: Andy Mabbett, Adam Kliczek

The main purpose of this session is to provide information about some interesting projects related to the GLAM sector across the CEE region. Special part of the session will be dedicated to the new perspectives in the sector worldwide and the possibility of its implementation in the region. The time slot should include presentations about the positive examples of projects in the GLAM sector.

Who is who?
  • Adam Kliczek (user:CLI, WMPL) - presenter
  • Andy Mabbett (WMUK) - presenter
  • Visem (WMUA - Ukraine) - contribution speaker
  • Kalman Hajdu (WMHU - Hungary) - contribution speaker
  • Fae (WMUK) - contributing information
  • Yerpo (Slovenia) - contribution speaker
  • Adam Kliczek (WMPL) made a presentation about Wikiexpedition.
    • they made several years, when a group of 4-5 Wikimedians were taking pictures for about 10 days in different regions in Poland. Each of the Wikiexpedition took thousands of pictures to Wikimedia Commons.
    • it is important to have different roles like, treasure, guy to calm down conflicts etc.
    • they travel by car
    • 100-150 km per day
    • list of objects (national monuments list)
    • they left on guy in the town and the rest of the group was taking pictures of the surroundings
    • Public Relations:
      • send press release to local newspaper - there is one person, who is responsible to send a message to the local media, what Wikiexpedition are doing
      • wikipedia T-shits, bussiness cards, wikiphotographer to take pictures, when members of the team were interviewed, ID cards of WMPL membership
    • Locals help:
      • if we cant find a place, they asked locals
      • important not bo be affraid of priests ;)
    • Facebook:
      • it was usefull, because they reached people not involved in wiki project - people gave other pictures to Commons or share their enthusiasm. The problem is FB doesnt allow CC licenses so is better to upload lower resolution images and link to Wikimedia Commons.
      • it was also useful to upload pictures of the group itself in the work
    • Sponsors:
      • Sony Poland - ultra wide lens
      • ask those who offer something the group would need (e.g. navigation, telecomunication etc.)
    • Car:
      • large car or minivan
      • driver should be prepared for 2000 km per 10 days, it could be a friend of you who is not from Wikimedia
    • Things to remember:
      • have a fun with teammates
      • reduce the costs
      • prepare for a hard work
      • things with wikipedia logo, for people who help you
      • speak with property owners, before you take pictures, rather it may cause problems

Quick checklist:

  • Wikiexpeditions
    • Choose area of low Wikimedia availability, little Commons media
    • Budget to cover travel, simple accommodation
    • Publish a target map, key artefacts, places
    • Press release for local news, local radio; everyone in branded teeshirts; take badges or pens to give away
    • Named treasurer, press relations, navigator
    • Advice and guides from friendly local Wikimedians; ask for reduced price tickets
    • Mobile scanning for locals keen to donate their photos
  • Andy (WMUK):
    • QRpedia <>:
      • Museums sometimes have a different QR code for each different language web page; OK for 2 or 3, but Wikipedia articles can have 100+
      • QRpedia server detects user's language setting in the mobile phone. If the article doesn't exist in such language it returns a list of available languages
      • used in Museums, on monuments, in botanical gardens or zoos, churches, pubs, railway stations
      • Walk-through of
      • fixing ceramics or plastic plaques on the buildings which can be removed, cost about 20 to 35 EUR and could be sponsored by Chapter or WMF; or civic authority, etc. They can be removed from historical monuments - the reson, why they glue it by mortar
      • QRpedia codes place nearby bookstores or on the windows of shops (cheese, shoes)
      • placed on historical pubs, which helps people
      • they made training sessions for the different groups how to edit Wikipedia (e.g. birdwatching group, gardeners, scouts, etc.)
      • they even placed QRpedia codes in books in Monmouth's libraries
    • Geo coords:
    • GibraltarpediaA:
      • There has been controversy for GibraltarpediA due, in part, to relations with tourism authorities. Andy argues the case that this cannot be avoided for 'Heritage Tourism' if we are interested in historic locations which are also of tourist interest, and whose archve images and rights of access (not least to affix QRpedia plaques) are held by or via such bodies. How we collaborate and handle the relationships needs much wider discussion.
      • Example map of Gibraltar showing an offshore shipwreck which has an article.
    • Hamburgmuseum project - Andy has been working with collaborative translators, for example between the Israel and German chapters to cross-translate via English from German to Hebrew. Andy wants to hear from others interested in collaborating on translations
Questions and discussion
  • Yerpo (Slovenia): When you trying to set up a QRpedia project, how can you ressue the GLAM that the article will be good quality and will not be vandalized?
    • Andy: we link only to quality article. If the article is not good, we train the musem personel to make it better or use the help of volunteers. Vandalised articles: museums are informed about article life and how this could be reverted. They can be advised to make clear that they are not responsible for Wikipedia. Presentation Polish Wikiexpeditions main page (translation to English in progress…) Pictures from Polish Wikiexpeditions at Wikimedia Commons Best pictures taken at Wikiexpedition 2012 Vicuna Uploader software by Yarl My page at Wikimedia Commons

  • Andy asks the audience: why you are not working with GLAM?
    • Visem (WMUA): I wrote several articles about museums
  • Andy: do you talk to the local musem?
    • Visem: yes
  • Andy -> Лады from Greece: Do you talk to your museums?
  • Лады: I know it is happening, but it is complicated because of leagal issues. They have copyright issues, which block them to upload pictures to Commons.
  • Andy: Training for curators, showing what they can and can't do on Wikipedia. Ask the GLAM to welcome Wikipedians to museum and to their archive (and to provide coffee and cake!). This helps people to open to you. They explain, who they are and what they are asking.
  • Fae: legislative question is not easy. It took two years the negotiation with British museum and British Library. So there were no policies or they had to change 20 years old policies and Wikimedians are happy, that curators worked with them on that.

Technological issues across CEE countries edit

Nikola Smolenski with his presentation in the session Technological issues across CEE countries

Duration (min): 75 Type of session: presentations with discussion Facilitator: Tanja Mladenović Presenters: Nikola Smolenski

This session aims to open some technological questions that are present in the CEE countries and how to manage with them to find a proper solution. One of the main problems is the existence of multiple writing system in some languages, while another one is the localization of content. The session will include presentations focusing on the related issues.

  • Script conversion
    • Variants no longer sticky
    • Impossible for old/new Armenian? (If possible, could be applied to Belarussian too.)
  • Long URLs
    • Especially a problem with QR codes
    • Entire application stack needs to handle them
    • URL shortener as an intermediate solution (will WMF support it?)
  • No free fonts
    • Serbian бдпт issue
    • Glagolitic
  • шшђђ
    • Alternative keyboard layouts not a good solution
    • Various personal hacks
    • Needs community acceptance

Educational projects edit

Filip Maljković (right), Ivan Matejić (centre) and Jan Loužek (right) during the session Educational projects

Duration (min): 60 Type of session: presentations with discussion Facilitator: Julija Vojinović Presenters: Filip Maljković, Ivan Matejić, Jan Loužek

It is always deemed that introducing Wikimedia in education provides a good source for natural growth of the communities, but also leads to promotion of the content available on the Wikimedia projects. How to reach out to the educational institutions and what is the programme that should be implemented are among the most important questions that should be answered during the session. The time slot is also reserved for presentations with some positive examples of educational projects and some tips that should be taken into account when starting up such initiatives.

Who is who?
  • Filip Maljkovic (Dungodung, WM RS) - presentation
  • Ivan Matejic (Ivan25, WM RS) - presentation
  • Jan Loužek (Aktron, WM CZ) - presentation
  • Filip: what is the educational project?
    • cooperation with schools
    • challenge - WM projects are not well suited for school projects
    • don't approach professors with a finished idea
    • compromise for wiki, professors and students
    • student retention is a problem and a goal
      • presenting Wikipedia to students as a useful and fun thing to do
    • topics should follow course/topics
    • present wikipedia realistically, but make it attractive
    • theoretical lectures
      • politics (Wikipedia/Wikimedia policies etc)
      • tech (how to write/edit articles)
    • doing practical work/practice with students
    • smaller groups are better
  • Ivan: wiki in high schools
    • much the same as on faculties, but pupils are younger and need more time
    • one way to start a project - contacting high school one is familiar with (former high school etc)
    • ideal project scope - around 2 month: 1 month for students to write project, second for evaluation/correction
    • at the end of writing professors should give grades, part of final grade for some topic should be for wiki-work
    • main goal is to bring wikipedia into educational system (this means contacting ministry of education)
  • 3rd grad was the best grad for working with High School students.
  • Quality was 'pretty good' - experience was that around 15 new articles were created to a high standard.
  • University projects have not happened recently with past cooperations stopped. The quality was not that good and it has not been attractive to researchers, teachers assistants and professors due to the time invested. Example of Wikinews being used to help training undergraduate journalists. Students have also be encouraged to create a project using a grant from Wikimedia.
  • best subjects are from science - easiest for students to participate
  • professors are not necessarily good editors
  • grading: teachers grade the work, wikipedia "grades" the article
  • between 50 and 100 articles per semester
  • when public outreach is one of the requirements for education, they usually come to wikipedians for help (easiest way to have public outreach is to put ones work on wikimedian project)
  • Fae brought this up in discussion - - this was a recent large conference in the UK focused on University collaborations. There is a clear separation between school outreach and university, academic and funding body outreach as the interests and objectives of these sectors are very different.
Jan presentation about cooperation with educational institutions in Czech Republic
  • Used ambassadors - one per faculty/department
  • Have a defined portfolio for the ambassador so the 'job' is well understood.
    • faculties usually don't know anything or know very little about WIkipedia
    • Students get course credits for their work creating articles; this gives them a strong motivation.
    • professor that is also a Wikipedian is usually very good :D also, older professors tend to be scared of Wiki projects
    • results: tens of professionally written articles
      • for students: they get familiar with what Wikipedia is and how it works
      • students say: they like to write wikipedia, it is easy and intuitive but it takes too much of students time to do it properly
      • breakdown of articles by topics
    • current situation
    • projects started from scratch - haven't used any external educational resources, only the idea is taken from US project

The presentation is available for general public:

Wikidata edit

Who is who?
  • Andy Mabbett (UK)
  • en.Wikipedia uses subtemplates in infoboxes (various date templates, e.g. {{Plainlist}], {{Flatlist}}, {{Start date}}, {{Birth date and age}}). How will WikiData work with these? - A very complex issue and without clear solution yet.
  • Could Wikidata help with {{cite book}} and other citation templates? - Yes.
  • How would querying Wikidata look like? - Probably some sort of query language for experienced users, wizards for others.
  • What if a user wants to edit a list produced by wikidata? - Probably they should be visually different to make it clear the list is not editable.
  • Will WikiData render WikiSpecies redundant? - Yes.
  • Will WikiData render DBPedia redundant? - Yes, but it still may serve as a frontend.
  • Vandalism.
  • Problem with a new level of separation. - It will be possible to edit Wikidata from Wikipedia.

Freedom and Wikimedia edit

This particular Etherpad documents the Freedom and Wikimedia session:

The main purpose of this session is to discuss the freedom of Wikimedia as seen after the law proposals in some countries, such as PIPA, SOPA, or ACTA, that restrict the spreading of free content on Internet and thereby Wikipedia. Some of the communities have already reacted to these proposals by blacking out the main page and blocking the content on some projects, while intensive protests against the introduction of such laws were held across several European cities. It is planned the discussion in the session to include sharing some experiences of the people from the communities that felt endangered by the law proposals. The main questions related to the topic include:

  • How to prepare in order to protest the implementation of restrictive laws?
  • Can Wikipedia be able to retain its image after the introduction of such laws?
  • What the Wikimedia Chapters can do to keep a higher level of freedom?
  • How to assure the authorities about the benefits of Wikimedia projects?
  • How can Chapters be better coordinated to avoid duplication of effort?

Nikolas Becker (theredmonkey) (WM DE) [] Everyone!

Possible threats to Wikipedia
  • ACTA
  • Breach of Duty of Care
    • CETA (Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement)
  • protection of personality rights
  • e.g. "A clean and open Internet" with take down rules
  • General Data Protection Regulation
    • "right to be forgotten" proposed in Article 17
What can we do against them?
  • blackout - cannot be used too often, because it will lose it's effect
  • talk to Parliaments
  • talk to government
  • Talk to society (Press, public protests)
  • Laws are being codified at EU level
EU Lobbying
    • getting informed
      • in time
      • in depth
    • chapter coordination
      • to avoid duplication of effort
      • to speak with one voice
What do we need?
  • monitoring of legislative process
  • "alarm system"
  • coordinate positions
Possible solutions
  • hire professional company
  • have someone in Brussels to do the monitoring of new laws
  • support existing organizations
Open questions
  • How can Chapters be better coordinated to avoid duplication of effort?
  • how to organize?
    • openess
  • substantive positions/issues
Q & A, discussion
  • Fae: presented to a (Government) Parliamentary Committee in the UK, it is immensly time consuming to understand, analyse and justify a position.
  • Andy: there are various open/free knowledge groups that also have this issue, with which we can cooperate/coordinate on this (some of them are political; we mustn't be partisan)
  • GoranO: why not to hire professionals?
    • N: e.g. learning effects
  • Ivo (Estonia): situation in Estonia: outdated copyright laws, Estonian chapter is involved in reform of those laws
  • Evgenia (Greece): impact of the action in Greece (blackout with banners got media attention)
  • Nicole (to chapters): how do you learn about this and do you keep yourself informed on EU laws

Working groups edit

Initially, there were six nominated topics and each participant was able to vote for one of them. The three most voted nominations were chosen as topics for the working groups (Communication in virtual society, Making a grant application, and Translation of articles). The other three that received less votes were rejected (Community and chapters relations, Wikimedia and external partnerships, and Wiki Loves Monuments).

Communication in virtual community edit

The working group having discussion

This particular Etherpad documents the Working group I - Communication in virtual community:

Jagro asked about ways of comunication of Polish system administrators.

  • There's a closed mailing lists for admins
  • There are only 5 check users in Polish Wiki, so there is no special list for them.

Kalman Hajdu: After admin conflicts some people left the project and the number of Wikipedians is lower, how to resolve such situations?

  • Courses for admins
  • Saper: Mentoring program for new admins in the UK. Election process is hard, so after becoming an administrator it's important to know you are still a Wikipedian, not a superhero. ;)
  • Estonian Wikipedia: 37 admins, 25 active, no mailing list
  • In Polish Wiki all mailing lists are open (except the admin list), so is the board meeting
  • Some Wikipedians tend to think that the responsabilities of admins are very limited, however, the truth is completely different (they are the ones who do so called "donkey work")
  • About 300 admins (about 200 active) in German Wikipedia

"Report error" link next to each article (for those who, for some reasons, do not want to edit Wiki) - there's a special form for it and there's a special page with all reports (currently 211 claims). If a given error remains uncorrected for 2 weeks, the report is transferred to its discussion page (bot).

Problem with discussion pages on Wikipedia - using two talk pages often causes confusion. English Wikipedia has some working solution for comunication on one page only Communication using IRC channels in Polish Wiki - open channel, more than 60 people online right now. Board Meeting also by IRC.

Jagro: It's important to have not only online, bu also a real contact with your Wiki-friends.

What to do when admin leaves and then wants to re-join - he or she should go through a normal election process.

Making a grant application edit

This particular Etherpad documents the Working group II - Making a grant application

  • Asaf Bartov (WMF) - facilitator
  • Nikole Ebber (WMDE) -
  • MZaplotnik (Slovene WP community)
  • Susanna (Armenian community)
  • Goran (WMSR)
  • Tamara (WMSR)
  • Filip (WMSR)
  • Evgenia (Greece)
  • Kiril
  • Mille
Issues harvest
  • Asaf: What we are going to do here?
    • MZaplotnik (Slovene WP Community): structure of grant proposal and what kind of discussion to expect from reviewers before the grant is approved?
    • Goran & Tamara (WM Serbia): a)decission making+1 b) what are dons to avoid, when grant is recived
    • Serbian lady: wants previous a, and underspending and alocation
    • Fillip: is it posible to restructuralize the grant, which was already approved
    • Evgenia (Greece):what should be done to do properly the grant proposal and what are good practices
    • Susana Mkrtchyan (Armenia): a) grants from external sources and matching them b) reserves
    • Kiril: how much money will be allocated in 2013 and what about the other chapters: $400K via Grants program; $10.2 million via FDC.
    • Mille: how to manage people in WMF grant comitte to work better - e.g. long waiting time, a lot of people, not active people +Kiril
    • Nicole: will help us
Grant proposal
  • Asaf: show meta:Grant:Index (WMF page, WMDE has different page):
    • instructions and help for the people, who havent done that before
    • live presentation, how to propose grant to WMF (link to screencasting video you will make?)
      • there are hidden examples on that page, which will help you to fill up your proposal to WMF
      • e.g. FIT TO STRATEGY
        • difficult for you and also for us
        • there are actually bad tools to measure that and WMF is working on that - there will be general analitics team - they will measure quantity
        • it's harder to measure quality (GLAM measure it on en.wp via the quality evaluation which works naturaly there)
        • YOU can try to set your measure way, but FDC will not persecute it if you got it wrong, as FDC/WMF doesnt know itself
        • e.g. Germans had MoS that people will show up on the conference
        • WMF would like to know, who is doing that work, but doesnt need to have wiki skilled people
What kind of discussion is around ground proposal
  • Asaf: Grand Advisory Comittee (made by Asaf) brings more community perspectives as there are people from the community
    • so people from GAC will respond to your proposal, but as it is wiki sometimes "everybody" can come and communicate, than also Asaf discuss there
    • WMF doesnt announce the grant application, so there will not be crowds of other people discussing
    • Recommendation: respond in the short time
    • there might come opposing commentaries, so it is important to repond also those
      • Recommendation: dont get frustrated from these. You have to slowly and patiently explain that it is not a crazy idea. Or ask "why do you think it is a crazy idea". It is "very much of negotiation
  • 94 % of the grants are accepted
    • the reason is not because people write the perfect grant appliation, but because of the engagment with GAC and Asaf = negotiation. GAC/Asaf usually change the grant a little bit asking questions and so on
    • Asaf: think about it if is realistic before approving and if he think not he sais it
Example of rejected proposals
  • there are grants which were canceled
  • there are grants which were not approved - which is the different category
  • Nicole: can you apply money for month?
    • Asaf: no, but for one year or maybe more
  • Nicole: is there a specific time, when the sucess should come?
    • Asaf: no, WMF is very flexible
Wikimedia DE programes

(talks Nicole)

  • Asaf sais not to hesitate to ask Asaf and GAC about grant idea - they will have you
  • Mile: ask early to have time to improve it, when nothing goes well from the point of view of Asaf/GAC - so talk to people and ask people for help an opinion

Translation of articles edit

Andy Mabbett (second in the top row from right to left) participating in the discussion of the working group

This particular Etherpad documents the Working group III - Translation of articles:

Participants & languages
  • BraneJ (WM Serbia; Serbian, English)
  • Ievgen Buket
  • Andy Mabbett - Енди Мабет - Endi Mebet (UK; English)
  • Sabrican Sarak - Сабриђан Сарак - Sabriđan Sarak (Turkey, Turkish, English, Azeri)
  • Pavel Selitskas (Wizardist, Wikimedia Belarus, English, Belarus)
  • Viktor Semeniuk (Wikimedia Ukraine; English, Ukrainian)
  • Nikola Smolenski (WM Serbia; Serbian, English)
  • Toni Ristovski (Macedonian Wikimedian Community)
  • Raul Veede (Oop, Wikimedia Estonia; Estonian, English, Russian)
  • Translation tools - Google translate; Is it any good?
    • OK for single words/ phrases and rough translations, but results always need proof-reading
    • Google translate tools
  • Translation memory: useful for e.g. translating messages
  • SVG Translate
  • Names of places in different languages - places that don't have name in that language, or need to be transliterated/transcribed
  • Problems with maps
  • Turkish Wikipedia: graduate students translate articles form German Wikipedia to Turkish, and also from English or Simple English Wikipedia
  • Idea of Simple English Wikipedia: young people, people learning English, people with disabilities (dyslexia; Down Syndrome; learning disabilities)
  • Value as a teaching tool (translate from language you are learning into language you already know)
  • If you need to translate an article into English (for example, so that someone can then translate it into a third language), but are not a native speaker, ask an English-speaking Wikipedian to proof-read your work; and in return translate an English-language article of their choosing, into your language.
    • Translation exchange: if you'd like to see your article translated, you can offer that, in return you will translate an article that the translator chose to your language.
  • Problems of terminology
  • Problems of badly-translated technical terms (radioactive particle detector → radioactive detector of particles)
    • Sometimes a rough translation is good enouh for others to work on and improve.
  • Example of table of articles in (and wanted in) various languages: <>
  • Visitor stats for tourists and migrant commnities can indicate which langues would be most useful. e.g. <> (PDF)
  • Working on Wikipedia can help improve language skills!
Translation requests