User:Robertinventor/removed sections
Why we can't just go through the existing system to find answers to these questions edit
As it is now, you are just told "you are topic banned" and that's it. The only person you can ask about gray area edits is the editor who closed the action against you, as is clear from en:WP:BMB: "Bans apply to all editing, good or bad":
If there is any doubt whether a limited ban prohibits any specific edit, the banned editor should assume that it does, unless whoever imposed the ban expressly clarifies that it does not.
Also, you are banned from mentioning the topic itself anywhere on Wikipedia including editor talk pages, and you can't refer to the discussion that led to the ban or the behaviour of the editors who banned you. So how do you ask for help about it? en:WP:TBANEX does say you can mention the topic for purposes of asking for clarification of the scope of the ban, or for appeal, but the way this is applied in practice seems very restrictive, so that it's almost impossible to discuss the ban at all with the enforcng admin. I can give a couple of examples from my own experience, to show both how very careful you have to be (in the first discussion he warns that I'll be blocked if I continue) and how, if my experience is typical, most questions just don't get answered at all.
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He didn't give any reason for ending the conversation in the second case, so I don't know what rule or established practice my questions violated there. And in both times, most of my questions were unanswered. |
The upshot is that, whatever the intention behind en:WP:TBANEX, that it's almost impossible to get much help from anyone on wikipedia or answers to questions you have once you are banned. There is also no support at all, no sympathy, and no attempt to help you in practical ways to reform your editing habits or whatever issues lead to the ban. And by en:WP:BMB, if the closing admin can't or won't answer your questions then you can't go to anyone else for help.
Currently, if you find yourself topic banned, there is no area for you anywhere Wikipedia to talk freely about your topic ban at a meta level to ask the questions that would be natural to anyone in that situation. Including, helping each other.
Need to treat topic banned editors with dignity as human beings edit
From en:WP:CONDUCTTOBANNED:
Wikipedia's hope for banned editors is that they will leave Wikipedia or the affected area with their pride and dignity intact, whether permanently or for the duration of their ban
We need to find a way to treat topic banned editors with respect and dignity, and to encourage the ones that are only topic banned or temporarily blocked to find a way back to productive editing and to take part in the wikipedia editing community along with other participants there, to learn what they can and can't do under the ban, and to find out how they can improve their editing / talk page behaviour on wikipedia.
Incidentally, I'm an editor in good standing myself, if you look at my edit history, its only in one small topic area, related to one particular page that I'm topic banned. [1]. So I think I'm an example of how an editor who is generally a good member of wikipedia can sometimes find themselves topic banned in some subject or other.
Also, amongst all those who are topic banned each year, there must surely sometimes be some who are unfairly banned as well, so you can't really assume that everyone who was topic banned was justifiably banned even in that topic area, never mind more generally. Any judiciary process has its glitches. If someone wants to appeal their ban, they should have a place where they can be listened to, again with dignity and respect