CIS-A2K/IRC meeting 2020-01-12



  1. abartov
  2. Seddon
  3. Bodhisattwa
  4. mahir256
  5. Pavan
  6. cherishsantosh
  7. Squiggletrotter
  8. Subodh
  9. Titodutta
  10. Ananth
  11. bhuvanameenakshi

IRC Chat log


Subodh 17:56:20
Agenda -
1. Wikidata activities in India - Present status and proposed
2. Proposed TTT 2020 - Ideas & expectations of the community

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cherishsantosh 17:56:56

Bodhisattwa 18:01:00
Its time. Shall we start? Or, shall we wait for few more minutes for others to join?

Subodh 18:01:56
Let's wait for 5 min. only

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Subodh 18:04:57
I welcome all to this IRC on behalf of CIS-A2K. This year, we will have regular monthly IRCs. To begin with, I request Bodhi to brief about some recent activities related to Wikidata in India

Bodhisattwa 18:05:18
Thanks Subodhji.

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Bodhisattwa 18:06:10
As you may know, there are some activities going on around Wikidata in India for last couple of years
A dedicated wikiproject is there for India
And editors are trying to build databases wrt this project
I hope the participants here are mostly aware of some of the activities happening around

Subodh 18:09:28
How many active editors are there?

Bodhisattwa 18:10:08
There are very few power users, who are doing all the heavy duty work actually
mostly the activities are around West Bengal and Kerala
Mahir here is one of the wizard we have

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Bodhisattwa 18:12:16
there is a social media channel, where we try to communicate to the larger community
build something ourselves and call people to engage
But, unfortunately that is not working as expected

Subodh 18:13:28

Bodhisattwa 18:13:52
we have started quarterly newsletters, a platform for skill sharing and social media channel
this is the latest newsletter we published
The facebook and twitter channels are run by Mahir, which post one query daily, to attract new audience
Mahir can tell more about the impact these channels have

Bodhisattwa 18:17:03
We have also an upcoming institutional partnership with a central government institute around Wikidata and Wikisource
The news will come soon, I guess
MoU has been finalized and they will be signed soon.

Subodh 18:18:28
Could we all list the reasons for less participation in Wikidata? Then the ways to overcome it.

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mahir256 18:19:18
There's this perception that Wikidata is more 'difficult' to use than other Wikimedia projects

Bodhisattwa 18:19:52
there has not been any study on this, but I feel, Indian Wikimedians who simultaneously contribute in different projects, are totally occupied

bhuvanameenakshi 18:20:19
Hi.. This is Bhuvana (gender gap researcher at CIS-A2K)... Glad to be here :)

Bodhisattwa 18:21:01
There are national campaigns running for months around Wikipedia and the thin line of user base we have around Wikidata or Wikisource are getting thinner because of that
Mahir, what do you think? Can it be a reason?

Subodh 18:21:53
It is difficult to visualise the impact of contributions, usefulness to the society.

Subodh 18:23:01
If people search for any knowledge, they land on WP or WS. How Wikidata be places in this context?

mahir256 18:23:02
Yes the campaigns could well be thinning our potential userbase--consider the excitement around Independence Day in 2018 and the considerably reduced excitement one year later

Bodhisattwa 18:23:14
Actually, its easier to visualise than other projects. Through our social media channels, Mahir tries to attract audience solely based on the visualisations

Subodh 18:24:58
If these visualisations are in local languages, what will be the change in response?

Bodhisattwa 18:25:17
The national campaigns have huge amount of money floating around as prize, which, I guess, has changed the motivation of volunteer users

Subodh 18:26:42
Asaf, Santosh..any inputs?

Bodhisattwa 18:27:14
Visualisations are displayed in local languages, taking care of the cultural and linguistic context.
at least in social media

cherishsantosh 18:27:29
national campaigns what will be target audience? Colleges?

mahir256 18:27:35
To provide query results in local languages requires translation of the results into those languages--which Bodhi and I can only provide in Bengali (and maybe, if Bodhi wishes, Hindi)

cherishsantosh 18:28:28
prize in terms what?

Subodh 18:28:33
Neatly compiled datasets are also not easily accessible. I am trying to get metadata of libraries in Maharashtra for the last one year.

Bodhisattwa 18:28:48
This is a vicious cycle. Less editors > less labels in local language > less visualization in local language > less editors

Subodh 18:29:06
Santosh, he is referring to Project Tiger like contests

Bodhisattwa 18:29:15

cherishsantosh 18:29:17
Ok got it

mahir256 18:30:03
Bodhi and I are also hesitant to work on regions of India outside Bengal due to lack of involvement from people in those regions

Bodhisattwa 18:30:44
Subodhji, its almost nearly impossible to get datasets which are perfectly clean, even the government datasets are full of obvious errors

Subodh 18:30:56
What can be other outputs for attracting, other than visualisations?

Subodh 18:32:57
Like Google maps displays WP article of places in local languages also. How Wikidata output can be taken to larger masses through such connections? Any ideas...

Bodhisattwa 18:33:32
we (both Mahir and me) have tried to attract people working on the front ourselves, dealing the difficult parts and handing over the almost end products for other community members. But that too has not much been successful

Bodhisattwa 18:34:52
we can do mass workshops, but I dont feel that would help much

Subodh 18:35:27
I think we have to identify target audience carefully, like researchers

Bodhisattwa 18:35:49

bhuvanameenakshi 18:35:53
The workshops will be useful to narrow down the audience with the required skills and interest
I agree with Subodh ji too

Bodhisattwa 18:36:49
we have tried with workshops previously. The whole project gained momentum because of Asaf's mega yatra.
After that we had follow-up workshops in Kolkata at least twice

Subodh 18:38:04
Now let us explore some proposed activities in the next 6 months. Some innovative ideas, may be action research, some small pilots in 2-3 regions

Bodhisattwa 18:39:12
I think, we will gain some visibility and attention, when we will succesfully execute the institutional partnership, I was talking about

Subodh 18:39:27

Bodhisattwa 18:39:36

mahir256 18:40:03
I've also been planning some tutorial videos on how to use Wikidata (providing India-related examples), but have not yet found time to comfortably make them

Subodh 18:41:08
How can CIS help in developing these resources? In local languages too..

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pavan 18:42:12
Hello all

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Bodhisattwa 18:43:33
I am not in favour of handbooks for WIkidata. Video can be the resource to attract
Mahir and I will be working on them, but it might take some time

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Subodh 18:44:08
Pavan, We discussed the reasons for less participation in Wikidata in India. Now let us explore some proposed activities in the next 6 months. Some innovative ideas, may be action research, some small pilots in 2-3 regions

Bodhisattwa 18:44:26
as we both are too much pre-occupied running the projects

pavan 18:44:40
Thanks for the briefing Subodh

cherishsantosh 18:44:53
Sorry guys dropping off.
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Bodhisattwa 18:45:19
Tutorial videos dont need professional help, but yes, some professional touch can pay off

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Subodh 18:45:42
Bodhi, any prospective community we can collaborate with to develop these resources? You can be mentor.

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Bodhisattwa 18:46:20
as we both are amateurs, we might need someone to edit those videos in low budget
Subodhji, I can only think of Bengali and Malayali community for now

Subodh 18:47:42
Pavan, you have done some work regarding this. Can you help?

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pavan 18:48:25
Yeah. I agree with Bodhi's idea.

Bodhisattwa 18:48:29
If you can provide connections in Maharastra where you are doing partnership, I will be more than happy to do workshops there and build new community for Marathi

pavan 18:48:40
Having an editor will be a better idea to do

Subodh 18:48:46
Welcome Tito! We discussed the reasons for less participation in Wikidata in India. Now let us explore some proposed activities in the next 6 months. Some innovative ideas, may be action research, some small pilots in 2-3 regions

mahir256 18:49:19
yay it's tito

Subodh 18:49:37
Yes, I shall plan with Gokhale Institute soon. We ca

pavan 18:49:46
In fact, when getting an editor on contract, A2K can explore making other tutorial videos too

Subodh 18:50:32
Pavan, can you explain?

pavan 18:50:40
I mean

Bodhisattwa 18:50:44
Ok, Subodhji, I will talk to you about this via phone

pavan 18:51:23
1. Having an editor on board (might be under a contract) is a good idea

Subodh 18:51:59
You mean film editor?

pavan 18:52:08
2. When bringing someone like that A2K can think of WP, WS and other project tutorials too
No, Video editor, I guess

Subodh 18:53:02
Got it. go ahead

Bodhisattwa 18:53:07
Brazilian communities are working on tutorial videos for Wikidata. We can follow that model too. I am not aware of much details, but will explore

TItodutta 18:53:43
Good idea.

pavan 18:53:43
Upon coordination with some communities, A2K can explore possibilities of creatING various tutorial s for projects, along with Wikidata

mahir256 18:53:48
And they're in Portuguese afaik,
so A2K's videos should also be in local languages

Bodhisattwa 18:54:20

pavan 18:54:51
Yes, Community members can help by translation of the necessary text to make it happen

TItodutta 18:55:41
Yes, that can work and SRT files can be translated

mahir256 18:55:49
(If they're delivered in local languages, that's probably more effective IMHO)

Bodhisattwa 18:56:47
Portuguese videos are long, mostly around 2 hours. Too much longer tutorial videos are not good for viewers for learning something new

Subodh 18:57:28
We may use different visualisations according to liking of the lang community. Like politics in Maharashtra, Films in Telugu, Literature in Bengali etc. It is just guess!

Bodhisattwa 18:57:40
I and Mahir were discussing to create series of short videos (mostly within 5 mins, if possible), interconnected with each other
That would later become a good MOOC material

pavan 18:58:08
Yeah. That's really is very effective. There should be a tree of knowledge and everything should be sub divided into smaller topics.
Great approach Bodhisattwa

Bodhisattwa 18:59:28
We can start in English and Bengali, work on the subtitles and then approach other active language community members to work on their language version

Subodh 18:59:59
I think, teasers of 2-3 min. to be made to attract the attention towards Wikidata. The tutorials/process learning videos can be of long duration.
Two separate sets

Bodhisattwa 19:00:28
Yes, obviously SPARQL will take long time

pavan 19:00:28
No need subodh
Everything can be trickled down to various smaller topics
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Bodhisattwa 19:01:26
anyway, thats the idea for now. But, we cannot guarantee quicj delivery. It will take time
as we both are occupied in different other projects
We will start slowly one by one

Subodh 19:02:48
So, let us explore this activity more with the community to convert into action plan in near future.

TItodutta 19:02:51
Steps are to be planned... Two things... particular project (such as Wikidata, Wikisource),... and then particular arera (topic such as "how to use Indic OCR, or how to use TABernacle)... followed by planning the format of video (script etc)

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Bodhisattwa 19:03:19
Yes, thats the plan
I can have Indrajit to edit those videos.

Subodh 19:04:39
Any suggestions about the regional events in next 6 months?

Bodhisattwa 19:04:55
Maharastra can be done
will talk about it soon

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Bodhisattwa 19:06:27
I talked with Tamil community too, hopefully after April, we can do something there. There are already good resouce persons in Tamil Nadu, whom we can utilize

Subodh 19:06:37
I mean any ideas on collaborative efforts, workshops etc.

Bodhisattwa 19:06:53
yes, thats what I said

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Bodhisattwa 19:07:16
We had a plan with Assamese community, but things are not safe in Assam now
so, maybe later

TItodutta 19:07:54
What's about Maharashtra?

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Bodhisattwa 19:08:55
A workshop or partnership at Vigyan Ashram or Gokhale Institute, whatever is feasible
Subodhji will help on that

Subodh 19:09:36
GLAM mapping pilot is going on in Maharashtra. We are getting datasets of atleast 4 institutions soon. We shall plan around these in March-April

Bodhisattwa 19:09:44

Bodhisattwa 19:11:02
Regarding GLAM, we will start a huge amount of data ingestion soon, wrt 10 museums from India.
So, we are entering GLAM-Wikidata soon :-)

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TItodutta 19:12:08
For other communities, we should check with community members 5to find out the plans.

Bodhisattwa 19:13:12
I and Mahir check regularly with other communities. Not much is coming out from there. We had discussed on this topic at the start of IRC
Anyway, I guess, there is nothing more to discuss on Wikidata from my side.

TItodutta 19:13:46
Ya, but it is not only about Wikidata, about other projects also,

Bodhisattwa 19:14:07

TItodutta 19:14:21
For example I'll be interested to see how mini TTT/MWT/Regional TTT concept is evolved in future..

Bodhisattwa 19:15:21
Lets see
Subodhji, can we move to the next agenda

Subodh 19:15:43
Yes, Bodhi. Any other response/comments on the first topic? We need to move on to next topic.
Proposed TTT 2020 - Ideas & expectations of the community

TItodutta 19:16:44
TTT 2020 will be conducted in Feb/March... The dates are to be finalised yet (we are very close)... and hope to notify c ommunities in 3-4 days time
The agenda will be prepared after the needs-assessment... The city is yet to be decided... we are thinking about Bangalore/Delhi...

Subodh 19:17:48
No bidding this time.

TItodutta 19:18:29
Yes, we are checking different logistical things before selecting a city
So, I hope in a week's time TTT related information will be much more clear and available
Once the mails go to mailing lists, VPs etc

Bodhisattwa 19:19:58
Delhi is not a good idea, considering the current situation in the capital

Subodh 19:20:01
Yes, definitely.

TItodutta 19:20:42
Yes, that's why "checking different logistical things" :)

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TItodutta 19:21:58
Bangalore is of course an easy option from logistical perspective. This city thing should be clear in a couple of weeks or so, when we explore more options

Bodhisattwa 19:22:15
I have to leave now. Please continue..

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Subodh 19:23:06
Looking at the community status and activities across India, do you suggest any focus item for TTT?

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TItodutta 19:25:53
Wikisource-related topics might get a little more prominence if the community feel the same, I think

Subodh 19:28:34
If there are no other topics, should we close the IRC for today?

pavan 19:28:52
Just wanted to mention learnings from last TTT

Subodh 19:29:02
Yes, Pavan please

TItodutta 19:29:02
Yes Pavan, go ahead

pavan 19:29:40
1. There should somehow be some Advanced training for TTT participants based on abilities (write to Shyamal for specific details)
2. Planning should involve Follow up activities along with the event
That's it

TItodutta 19:30:34
Thanks for suggestions

pavan 19:30:50
Welcome 🙂
See you all

TItodutta 19:31:24
On a kind of similar but not same note, we have an advanced TTT this year, looking forward to it also.
Thank you all for participating.

Subodh 19:32:01
Thanks to all for participating in first IRC of 2020! Let us meet next month...With best wishes of New Year!

TItodutta 19:32:15
We are doing national IRC first Sunday of every month 7 pm to 8 pm. @Subodh ji confirm
Thanks, and have a good week ahead

Subodh 19:32:40
Yes, Please note this. Thanks Tito.

pavan 19:33:05
See you

TItodutta 19:33:08
Thanks. Goodbye for now :)